Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Jaap Verduijn on April 18, 2010 at 4:04pm

"(...) getting my members to cough up a lot of money every month WOULD be a big deal (...)"

Your members won't have to cough up anything. Ning will charge the Network Creators only.

Or do you mean that you are going to let your members pay your fee to Ning? You blame Ning for asking you to pay them, but you have no problem asking your members to pay you?

In short: it's alright with you that Ning must be paid, as long as it's by your members and not by you. Very clever.

Jaap Verduijn.

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Permalink Reply by Friends of musicians on April 18, 2010 at 5:58pm

Clever? Like I've got some diabolical money making scheme going? What's with the attitude? I can see you know nothing about me or my site. Um, any money raised would not be going to me, it would be going to NING, including my own contributed portion. Hello, anybody home?? And no, it's not "alright with me that NING must be paid"- I think it stinks. But neither I nor my 700 other community members will be able to stay there without NING being paid.

I would not be able to afford $100/month out of my own pocket to keep my site going if that's what NING were to decide to charge. I'd have to shut that site down and leave, perhaps rebuilding somewhere else if I can.
I hadn't mentioned anything on my ning site about NING's upcoming new policy, yet my members found out about it somehow and started their own thread and have already suggested they they would be willing to share and work together in whatever it took to keep it going. The 700+ members truly feel as if the site is their own community, not 'my' site. We are all members together there, all helping each other. I do know that if I put a Paypal donation button up, there would be incoming money to help pay the NING fees. The unknown aspect is just how much NING is going to want, and whether that amount will be too much for our community to raise on an ongoing basis to pay NING's fees. I am perfectly happy to pay a goodly share out of my own pocket, but the question would be how much are we talking about, versus would it be better to move to another host site altogether.

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Permalink Reply by Code Whacker on April 18, 2010 at 6:25pm

I have told my 100 plus members and they are starting to join my hedge my bets site on Webs, we will all move our data on to the secondary site. I had thought of something like this would happen so I had linked ning to our main website and its now easy to change the link to the secondary site if warranted. My society site on ning is only 4 months old its been growing and I am glad that I just linked the community as the URL will not have to be changed on our documentation advertising the society if ning goes down or phases out free accounts.

I would suggest that others that have been caught out use the same methodology to help ease the pain if their new choice of community site does the same as ning.

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Permalink Reply by Jaap Verduijn on April 19, 2010 at 3:44am

"(...) Um, any money raised would not be going to me, it would be going to NING, including my own contributed portion (...)"

Truly amazing, the crooked reasoning people employ when their cherished "right to free hand outs" is being challenged.

It's quite normal for a company that can't pay its bills, to raise their prices. That's what Ning is going to do, and what you disapprove of - which I understand perfectly well: nobody wants to pay more than strictly necessary. What I don't understand though, is how you immediately start preparing for doing a rather similar thing: if you can't pay the "Ning bill" anymore, you'll "raise the price" for your members. You even propose to do it in the same way that got Ning in the troublesome situation it's in now, namely by not making a little contribution compulsory, but by creating a paying "Premium" group and a non-paying "Free" group. The economy being what it is, there's a fair chance that what happened to Ning on a macro-level, will eventually happen to you on a micro-level: too many free members, and too few paying ("Premium") members to enable you to continue paying your bills. Then you'll be in Nings present position.

Secondly, your statement that any money raised would not be going to you but to Ning, is just a clever smoke screen. If the same screen would be employed by Ning, they would say: any money raised from our Premium members will not be going to Ning, but to our creditors. The IRS would consider that the funniest joke they've heard in years.

The money would really be going to you, and whether you'll use it to pay Ning (which, in all fairness, I don't doubt you will) or for having a monthly party in the local nudie bar, is irrelevant. Your members will be paying you, it's your income and, in the admittedly unlikely case that the amounts warrant it, it's you who'll be paying income tax on it.

Hope this has uncrooked some of your reasoning.

Be well!

Jaap Verduijn.

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Permalink Reply by Friends of musicians on April 19, 2010 at 10:03am

{{{Hope this has uncrooked some of your reasoning.}}}
Sorry, but I see your logic as twisted. I now see you are spewing your patronizing insults towards multiple posters concerning these issues. Frankly, I think you need a new hobby.

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Permalink Reply by Jaap Verduijn on April 19, 2010 at 11:30am

"(... ) Sorry, but I see your logic as twisted (...)"

Then, pray, show me the twist.

What I see on this forum is a bunch of greedy freeloaders who apparently never took the trouble to read the TOS, and are now hollering all over the place that Ning is cheating them. Remarkably though, none of them have managed to bring up even one single point where Ning has failed to adhere to its own TOS. All I see is "But we have a right, and "Ning should this..." or "Ning should that...", without even a single complainer admitting to having hit "I agree" when their opinion about the TOS was asked during signing up.

Each and every member of the club of "Woeful Wingers and Worrysome Whiners" here has agreed to #25 of the TOS, thereby recognizing Ning's right to end any service at any moment for any reason or even for no reason at all.

"(...) Frankly, I think you need a new hobby (...)"

In due course, in due course. At the moment I'm far too much enjoying the present one, namely playing the Devil's advocate on a forum where hysteria, melodramatics and selfpity are interfering with many a person's capacity to think.

But of course: be well!

Jaap Verduijn.

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Permalink Reply by Friends of musicians on April 19, 2010 at 11:59am

You may see yourself as a Devil's advocate. Others see you differently.
Glad you are 'enjoying yourself' by insulting people left and right here in your patronizing and pompous manner. But believe me, you are not helping your 'cause' (whatever it is) in any way. Ick.

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Permalink Reply by Jaap Verduijn on April 19, 2010 at 12:14pm

Naaah, I don't have a "cause". I just point out a few things here and there.

But please, again: tell me where my logic is twisted. May I venture a guess? You can't. That's fairly often the case, you know, when people make a statement like yours without elaborating on it and backing it up. So again: please tell me where my logic is twisted.

While you're at it: please also explain what #25 of the Ning TOS means if (as you seem to believe) it doesn't mean that Ning can discontinue any service at any time. Please enlighten me: what does it mean?

Be well!

Jaap Verduijn.

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Permalink Reply by Friends of musicians on April 19, 2010 at 6:34pm

Sorry, but I have way better things to do besides wasting my time feeding you fresh fodder for your 'enjoyment'.

Permalink Reply by Jaap Verduijn on April 20, 2010 at 2:06am

@Friends of the Mountain Dulcimer

I didn't think you would. Yours is the typical reaction of a person who keeps hinting he has lots of knowledge but, when challenged to share it, remains profoundly silent in order to continue the myth of his great wisdon. Very clever.

Jaap Verduijn.

Permalink Reply by My Perfect Network Answer on April 18, 2010 at 3:13pm

I'm downloading all my memberships and transferring to a private label website. It's foolish to continue to base my long term growth strategy with such a fickle company. I see Ning going the way of Yahoo groups where you only have a few diehard supporters. It's funny because Ning isn't even as well known as Yahoo, Myspace, Twitter, or Facebook. It was niche community that started to provide a valuable niche communities, now they have decided to change course. Best Success To them.

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Permalink Reply by Jaap Verduijn on April 19, 2010 at 5:54am

"(...) it would be a blessing by GOD, that ning allow us, (the already existing free-sites) to continue AS IS (...)"

Ah, the "God card" is finally being played - I was already wondering why it took so long.

It will be a difficult decision for the Supreme Being: Ning praying enthousiastically for their new business model having success and making it possible for Ning to remain in business, and the whining lot right here equally enthousiastically praying for the opposite.

Jaap Verduijn.

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